Thomas cucurbits' garden summer 2025 (+ some solanaceae!)

Those 6 fruits come from 6 different plants which come from a single fruit from last year, which was from a stable variety I had just introduced… highlighting the fact that each seed is the result of the encounter of a single ovary in a flower (mother plant) and a single pollen grain transported by the bees.

So I went from knowing it in theory to just see it… wooow! :blush: Amazing, wonderful…

… And last year’s fruit, was the best of all (it’s why I kept its seeds apart!), and… had beige skin colour by the way!

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They are beautiful Thomas!

I am very interested in the colour inheritance traits for the different crops, especially as I work on a small scale and would like to maintain visual diversity. I’m playing it safe by keeping things in colour groups (and a “free for all” group if I have enough space).

I’m looking forward to reading the conclusion of your taste experiments!

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you’re doing some beautiful work once again!

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Cover crop resown at my friends’ place : rye, oats, peas, vetsch, lupine, faba, etc. :partying_face:

I decided to let the tarps sit there rolled on the side…. I feel kind of stuck with this bad bad soil… but I may try super early direct sowing next year, when the soil is still really wet and still alive… my last trial. Possibly 1st of april and then… “good luck to all of you” :grin:

And just to recap why I feel “stuck” in that place: it’s because how that “bad bad soil” transcribes to yields : if I use tarps at that planting density (2 cucurbita plants/m2) a zero irrigation at my place where the soil is super low fertility, I get from 1,5 to 3,5kg/m2 of harvest. And with watermelons at 4plants/m2 it gives around 4.5kg/m2.

There, with cucurbita maxima, moschata and pepo, using some of the nicest transplants I ever did, at a very good timing, I harvested something around 200 kilogrammes on 700 m2, which corresponds to 0,3kg/m2. So it’s really not worth it.

Same with the watermelons: I had maximum 2kg/m2 + the seeds where horribly empty for most fruits, while harvested really mature!

Originally it’s exactly the same low fertility soil as mine, but my friend has been compacting so much the soil at 5-10cm deep by using the same tools every year, that in summer not a root can get in… so bye bye nutrients, microbiology and… water!

We’re nowhere near to a plant or a cover crop that could in itself decompact that. Best for him would be to either use that kind of decompactor… if only a neighbour had one…

…or let that soil regenerate itself on his own for the next 20-30 years or so. Which seems like the best option so far.

Same type of cover crop sown yesterday at my place following melons and watermelons crop on plastic tarp, with the “vines’ roll” on the right hand side, plastic tarp rolled on the left.

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If the compacted field is the same soil as your place, you could use it to select for strong genetics, and then those genetics will in theory produce better in your better field.

Just trying to follow a permaculture principle “the problem is the solution” :sweat_smile:

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Yes but… no :joy:

I understand the interesting thinking line but I’m already at my place on super low fertility grounds so I won’t do that. I’ll try other strategies… yet to uncover :wink:

What’s sure is that in that desperate field - if I ever come back - I’ll try really radical early sowing at least, to see the leverage I can get from that. Like 1.5 month in advance compared to 2025. Meaning : when the soil is wet and so slightly less compacted, when biology is still a bit active.

+Maybe homemade microbial inoculants on the seed, addition of brown organic matter in plastic tarp holes for heating the spot, and possibly foliar sprays with oxygenated compost tea for ex… maybe…

I’m curious, in the super compacted beds have you done a ‘fallow’ round of multi-spp cover crops featuring a largest percentage daikon? I’ve had pretty solid success in this manner to begin shifting clay or compacted soil-based hard pan into a more aerated tilth.

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No but they are part of the 10-12 species cover crops I have just sown. It’s interesting that they helped in your soil, in mine daikons do good if sown early but don’t bring any structural change. Maybe it’s because it’s sand vs clay, I don’t know…

haha I guess the problem is the problem then… but not your problem!

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Recap in… trailers!!! :wink:

Number 1

Number 2

Number 3

Number 4

you see gourds on the last one…

Also as I have to leave in 2 days for a month and a half I had to anticipate the harvest, so to say many moschata were collected quite immature… and finished to the compost… whereas first frost should happen between 15th of October to 15th of November… it’s a pitty maybe… let’s say I selected for earliness :person_shrugging:

Still that makes quite a few squashes :wink:

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The squash drive store of thomas ! :grin:

during your absence the squirrels are going to make good meals under your shelter :chipmunk: squash soup every dinner ! :rofl:

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I hope not :joy: In my experience they only go into rottening squash to get the seeds… :crossed_fingers:

Having harvested first dying Maximas in early September, and then Moschatas a fortnight after that, and that were all still very alive and higher yielding already, I’ve been first intrigued by this obvious difference in vitality (or at least in my fields… let me know about yours!)… and then hypothetized that their could be some underground factor at play … I had already red that in general Moschatas were more resistant, needed a longer growing season but were higher yielding globally.

What surprised me first in my maxima patch was those interspecific hybrids (maxima X moschata) that I intentionnally grew in the maximas: they were much more vigorous and… all still alive! So I decided to dug them up to examin the roots: much more fine root hairs showed up and they were all harder to pull up… and then I saw rerooting on those vines all around, when none on the maximas. Also most of Maximas had a single-line vine whereas Moschatas were much more branching from the point of emergence, showing up to 5 or 6 lateral branches, like a net.

So a fortnight after I did a global assesment of moschata roots while harvesting, and it was all consistant with those first observations.

Look at those rerooting + fine root branching on this particularly impressive Moschata:

This shows all signs of intense biological activity in the rhizosphere, even after shaking it:

Still searching for cues, I did cut also the stems at the point of emergence: some moschatas (like 10-20%) had intense accumulation of carotenes in the stem, supposedly a sign of superior health. Zero maximas showed that. Look for example this moschata with bright yellow-orange in the middle :

… Having discussed that very recently with one high level scientist in winter squash breeding, he said to me that - to his knowledge - nothing had been undertaken to characterize and then breed specifically for strong rooting systems… that except for grafting materials (like Tetsukabuto) which are nearly always interspecific hybrids, bred specifically for their strong rooting systems, overall vitality and pest tolerance…

So it seems to him like roots architecture, strength, vigor and overall characteristics are a 100% “underground” topic to the scientific community :wink:… all investigations are to be done… And I think it’s particularly relevant when we talk about “regenerative agriculture” : we WANT intelligent plants, able to have good relationships with soil biology! (See James White Going to Seed course on soil-plants interactiond, or some of John Kempf’s contents I’ve posted in the “Interesting Video Dump” topic…). No correlation seems to have been done yet in winter squash. For example: with above ground health, fruit yield, fruit storage, aromas, etc. Though that’s a really promising ground theoretically… as the complexity of aromas is depending upon the intensity of soil-plant interactions, mediated by biology (see J.White)…

More on that soonish

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Question is then, are there Maximas out there that do tend to reroot more than average? Apparently not in your field that is supposed to be quite diverse. More research to be done!

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Damn, i gotto get to harvesting mine as well before the congress in Croatia. I’ll have a looky if i can find some strong rooting. I’ve never seen more roots than the bush of hairs you show there on the photo. I wonder if it’s not partially a mechanical defense mechanism. Like tripwires all over the place to discourage animals to get to the heart/core where the precious fruits are maturing. With all those easily breaking stems serious damage can be done to the offspring. Partially shading out of competing grasses over that buyoning surface can be a second advantage for the offspring when it stays put all winter and animals have come and feasted on the fruits in winter making a big seedy mess of the place. Bweh gotto stop dreaming, i know nothing of the original evolution of cucurbitaceae. Did they even eat the fruits? Mine if they end up on the compost heap never get visited by anything butt wormfriends and molds.

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Of course some are rerooting more than average (average being none) but they are really small, like baby roots.

Anyhow that is relative to one field or land or fertility… Mine may behave quite differently in a highly fertile ground. So yes it’s the relative rerooting rerooting that I’m looking for :ok_hand:

On OSPB forum one said to me thzt ye saw the “Hopi White” variety being crazily vigorous comparatively to other strains. Sold by “Seed Dreams”. But I cannot find it on the Internet now…

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