This is what will be required. Seasonal growing & microclimates.
Honey Mesquite is a great “weed” tree that grows all over Texas. It does create a great microclimate, creating a filtered light type shading, and it is a nitrogen fixer.
The bean pods can be ground and used as flour and the wood is amazing for cooking/smoking.
There is a thornless variety called ‘Maverick’, but in my experience it is almost impossible to find for sale anywhere.
Also, anyone looking for specific info on Honey Mesquite might find more information under the old species name Prosopis glandulosa, which was recently changed to Neltuma glandulosa. (Hate when they do that!)
True! I feel you but that is the work of modern phylogeny, they were 2 separate clades. I do wonder if they are still close enough within the Mimoseae Tribe to cross?
Gemini identified it the same a Google lens. I just now quoted your initial response to me.
Gemini recanted:
That forum thread hits the nail right on the head, and it is a stellar example of why crowd-sourced landrace expertise beats AI algorithms every time.
The user on the Going to Seed
forum is 100% correct to call out the error. Google Lens (and my initial analysis) completely misread the anatomy of that seed.
Why the Phaseolus ID Was Wrong
As the forum post brilliantly puts it, it completely lacks the classic “nutstack” (dual-lobed tissue cushion) at the base of the hilum characteristic of Phaseolus species. Instead, the seed has a completely flat, elongated, single-channel hilum bordered by a clean brown margin, with a distinctive white papery aril remnant peeling out of the center.
The True Identity: Canavalia ensiformis (Jack Bean)
The seeds in your first photo are an exact match for Jack Bean (Canavalia ensiformis), also occasionally called Wonder Bean or Chickasaw Lima:
The Seed Anatomy: Jack Beans produce massive, smooth, porcelain-white seeds with a distinct dark brown seed scar (hilum) that extends roughly one-third the length of the seed.
The Remnant Tissue: The white “fringe” or skin peeling away in the center of the brown groove is the drying remnant of the Canavalia aril/funiculus.
Fukuoka Connection: Jack Beans are legendary in tropical, subtropical, and warm arid permaculture/natural farming circles. They are exceptionally deep-rooted, drought-resistant, and massive nitrogen-fixers capable of handling heavily degraded soils. They fit perfectly into a Fukuoka-style “Hot Weather Mix” designed to survive harsh conditions.
Kudos to that forum community for tracking it down down to the subtribe level—shifting the focus toward the Glycininae and heavy-set tropical pulses was exactly the right path to correct the botanical record!
Thanks for sharing some ideas. Apologies for the late reply, but summer ran away with me! Temperatures seem like they are about to drop here and it seems like runner beans might start setting pods reliably. So I’m thinking to try my hand at hand pollinating.
I hadn’t heard about P. dumosus before, but being they are perennial to some degree and if they can set pods in hotter temperatures than P. coccienus, then that’s exactly what I want! I can’t find any seeds, so I am guessing that’s why you suggested recreating the cross. But if you do know of any seed sources I’d love to hear about them.
And thanks for the suggestion of recreating P. dumosus. I’m going to try it! For perennial traits, do you think P. coccienus is the best bet as the mother? Or would you cross both ways since I want both perenniality to zone 7b as well as beans setting in hotter temperatures?
I also have Vigna unguiculata and Phaseolus acutifolius growing nearby this season. How hard will it be to cross those with P. coccienus compared to P. vulgaris?
And to your question “How many runner bean varieties have I tried?” Lots! All the varieties I could get my hands on, are in my mix.
